| Stranica u temi: [1 2 3] > | KudoZ questions posted with insufficient context Postavljač teme: liz askew
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liz askew 
Ujedinjeno Kraljevstvo
Local time: 10:04
Član (2007)
francuski na engleski
+ ...
The dreaded topic.
No doubt this has been discussed many times.
Yet, STILL translators do not provide sufficient context (meaning at least a paragraph/two to three sentences of the original text) for other translators to offer the best possible translation.
Only today, a person has asked for a translation of an English phrase, without any English context whatsoever.
Why are some of you so unhelpful?
It can be like finding a needle ... See more The dreaded topic.
No doubt this has been discussed many times.
Yet, STILL translators do not provide sufficient context (meaning at least a paragraph/two to three sentences of the original text) for other translators to offer the best possible translation.
Only today, a person has asked for a translation of an English phrase, without any English context whatsoever.
Why are some of you so unhelpful?
It can be like finding a needle in a b.............haystack. Of course you will all tell me not to bother with these people who don't give context; but I find this a negative and silly attitude.
Liz Askew
[Edited at 2008-04-12 15:46]
[Subject edited by staff or moderator 2008-04-12 17:27] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Henry Hinds
Sjedinjene Američke Države
Local time: 03:04
engleski na španjolski
+ ...
U sjećanje
I think I'll second that! CONTEXT...
| | | | | But what is the context ? | Apr 12, 2008 |
Is this regarding Kudoz queries, sample translations requested or the sample translations on profile pages?
| | | | gianfranco
Brazil
Local time: 07:04
Član (2001)
engleski na talijanski
+ ...
| I moved the question | Apr 12, 2008 |
Dear Liz,
I have moved your thread from the Off-Topic forum to the KudoZ forum, one of the several forums dedicated to specific ProZ.com features.
I have edited the title too. A title should try to convey a good idea about the topic discussed (it was "CONTEXT").
Also, please do not overuse uppercase, if not necessary. It appears a bit too screamed
Thank you
Gianfranco
... See more Dear Liz,
I have moved your thread from the Off-Topic forum to the KudoZ forum, one of the several forums dedicated to specific ProZ.com features.
I have edited the title too. A title should try to convey a good idea about the topic discussed (it was "CONTEXT").
Also, please do not overuse uppercase, if not necessary. It appears a bit too screamed
Thank you
Gianfranco
[Edited at 2008-04-12 17:31] ▲ Collapse
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liz askew
Ujedinjeno Kraljevstvo
Local time: 10:04
Član (2007)
francuski na engleski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME | I moved the question | Apr 12, 2008 |
Thank you!
I always have trouble posting my stuff in the right forum
Liz
I take your point too about not over-using upper case. I expect when I wrote this I had just seen yet another query that did not have enough context, hence my frustration, reflected in the capitalisation of "context". ... See more
| | | | John Jory
Njemačka
Local time: 11:04
engleski na njemački
+ ...
Hi Liz,
I fully support your views. My impression, without having done any research, is that 'contextless' postings come from newbies or part-time translators with a slightly limited horizon, i.e. they do not realize that many terms can have different meanings in different contexts.
In addition, more context enables us to pinpoint possible typos or even use of the wrong word by the author.
Perhaps site staff can consider rewording the relevant entry field. The wor... See more Hi Liz,
I fully support your views. My impression, without having done any research, is that 'contextless' postings come from newbies or part-time translators with a slightly limited horizon, i.e. they do not realize that many terms can have different meanings in different contexts.
In addition, more context enables us to pinpoint possible typos or even use of the wrong word by the author.
Perhaps site staff can consider rewording the relevant entry field. The word "context" does not appear anywhere, and IMO the suggestions provided:
"As much explanation as possible should be entered for the term. Consider including: type of document/situation, country and dialect, URLs, translations you are considering, etc."
do not highlight the importance of context in any way.
Why not suggest posting the complete sentence (or even better, the preceding and following sentences as well).
[Edited at 2008-04-12 17:51] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Kim Metzger
Meksiko
Local time: 04:04
njemački na engleski
| Some hopeless cases | Apr 12, 2008 |
liz askew wrote:
Yet, STILL translators do not provide sufficient context (meaning at least a paragraph/two to three sentences of the original text) for other translators to offer the best possible translation.
Only today, a person has asked for a translation of an English phrase, without any English context whatsoever.
Why are some of you so unhelpful?
It takes some newbies a while to get used to formulating their questions so that there's any hope of getting some useful input. Asking questions properly is hard work. Many newbies respond well to comments in the ask the asker box and become good members of the community.
In other cases, I'd say it's hopeless. I don't know if it's a negative and silly attitude, Liz. I think it's more likely that they just aren't translators. Some folks have been translating for years but aren't yet and probably never will be translators. They typically don't know enough about what they're doing to understand what context is or to be able to explain their problem in the language they're translating into.
Kim
[Edited at 2008-04-12 18:04]
| | | | Henry Hinds
Sjedinjene Američke Države
Local time: 03:04
engleski na španjolski
+ ...
U sjećanje | Seconded again... | Apr 12, 2008 |
I'll second what you just said too, Kim.
If I taught translation, which I'll never do, one of the things I would teach is the primary importance of CONTEXT in any translation effort. It is number one, and it includes a very large universe of considerations.
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| Just one of the problems in recent months | Apr 12, 2008 |
Dear Liz,
As Kim said, "I think it's more likely that they just aren't translators. Some folks have been translating for years but aren't yet and probably never will be translators. They typically don't know enough about what they're doing to understand what context is or to be able to explain their problem in the language they're translating into."
At least in my pair (Span-Eng) it seems in recent months there has been an explosion in Kudoz questions with the wrong direction (15-20%... See more Dear Liz,
As Kim said, "I think it's more likely that they just aren't translators. Some folks have been translating for years but aren't yet and probably never will be translators. They typically don't know enough about what they're doing to understand what context is or to be able to explain their problem in the language they're translating into."
At least in my pair (Span-Eng) it seems in recent months there has been an explosion in Kudoz questions with the wrong direction (15-20%, "reverse pair" has no affect), simple terms found in any dictionary (15-20%), titles of the documents to be translated (5%), terms from any good field-specific dictionary (especially legal, business and tech) and previous Kudoz questions now in glossaries (around 40%). Many appear to be posting for material in specific fields about which they are clueless not only in the target language, but also in the source language, for which reason they have no idea of the context. ▲ Collapse
| | | | liz askew
Ujedinjeno Kraljevstvo
Local time: 10:04
Član (2007)
francuski na engleski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME | ..."probably never will be translators" | Apr 12, 2008 |
Hello Richard (and Kim and Henry)
Perhaps I should just accept this and just move on and not let it bother me.
I sometimes am so concentrated on my own professionalism (I hope) that I forget we are not all singing from the same hymn sheet.
Your remarks have made me see a different side to the story.
I suppose just about anybody can contribute/ask questions on Proz, so the "hopeless" cases should be part and parcel of this.
I will t... See more Hello Richard (and Kim and Henry)
Perhaps I should just accept this and just move on and not let it bother me.
I sometimes am so concentrated on my own professionalism (I hope) that I forget we are not all singing from the same hymn sheet.
Your remarks have made me see a different side to the story.
I suppose just about anybody can contribute/ask questions on Proz, so the "hopeless" cases should be part and parcel of this.
I will try to sort out the wheat from the chaff then.
Cheers and thanks for making me smile.
Liz ▲ Collapse
| | | | Anne Bohy
Francuska
Local time: 11:04
engleski na francuski
| Even message catalogs have context | Apr 12, 2008 |
I remember having read a post, recently, justifying the absence of ANY context because it was an isolated sentence in a message catalog.
However, even if no other occurrence of the word(s) appear anywhere else in the catalog, the nature of the software this message catalog belongs to IS context.
If translators are reluctant to explain what they are working on, then they should solve this kind of issue with their customer.
Also, I would like to have a kind of flag associated to ... See more I remember having read a post, recently, justifying the absence of ANY context because it was an isolated sentence in a message catalog.
However, even if no other occurrence of the word(s) appear anywhere else in the catalog, the nature of the software this message catalog belongs to IS context.
If translators are reluctant to explain what they are working on, then they should solve this kind of issue with their customer.
Also, I would like to have a kind of flag associated to Kudoz questions, which would be "Ask to customer". A LOT of questions, in my opinion, require feedback from the customer, and it is only after insisting that askers do what they should have done before posting... ▲ Collapse
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Nicole Schnell
Sjedinjene Američke Države
Local time: 02:04
engleski na njemački
+ ...
U sjećanje
And help. New colleagues often don't know better. That's why we call ourselves a community instead of an ivory tower. Of course it's tough to get down from a 480' tall horse without a helicopter.
Edited - sorry for the typo.
[Edited at 2008-04-13 00:18]
| | | | | Educate by not answering | Apr 13, 2008 |
Nicole Schnell wrote:
Educate
And help. New colleagues often don't know better. That's why we call ourselves a community instead of an ivory tower.
One of the ways to educate is to refuse to answer till the asker explains the context and the surrounding text. One of the problems is that many people try to answer without context, so it's useless to ask them to write the context, they get their answer anyway. It's very easy the answer be wrong, but they don't realize.
| | | | KathyT
Australija
Local time: 21:04
japanski na engleski
| apologies in advance for hijacking the thread... | Apr 13, 2008 |
...but what has happened to our esteemed colleague, Kim Metzger?
Those three little 'x'es in front of his name suggest that he has left the site.
Surely this can't be true? That would be devastating news.
I don't post in the forums that often but am an avid reader, and I'm sure I'm not the only person who has benefited from Kim's wisdom and experience through reading many of his posts over the years. The loss would be even greater for those working in his language pairs. I real... See more ...but what has happened to our esteemed colleague, Kim Metzger?
Those three little 'x'es in front of his name suggest that he has left the site.
Surely this can't be true? That would be devastating news.
I don't post in the forums that often but am an avid reader, and I'm sure I'm not the only person who has benefited from Kim's wisdom and experience through reading many of his posts over the years. The loss would be even greater for those working in his language pairs. I really hope it's just temporary(?) and he will return, pronto! :-( ▲ Collapse
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