| Stranica u temi: < [1 2] | About the level of the questions - PRO and non-PRO Postavljač teme: lien
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| Democracy and stakeholders | Apr 19, 2005 |
two2tango wrote:
Service providers sometimes perform opinion polls to get a feedback on users' preferences, but then decide what to implement and how to do it based on their own criteria.
These are opinion surveys, nor binding referendums.
Of course. My point was that rather than bat points back and forth in forum postings, with people saying much the same things, drifting onto other (related and unrelated) topics, etc., why not just ask a series of basic questions to obtain a measurable opinion?
And the results of these surveys are rarely made public (why share this information with the competence?).
Fair point. I guess results could be emailed to a) all those who voted or b) all registered members.
Should such survey be conducted only among Platinum members, excluding non-paying members?
As a non-paying but nonetheless fairly active member, I would obviously be against the vote being restricted to Platinum only. People pay to be platinum for the advantages it brings to the Jobs aspect, not the Kudoz aspect (so if the poll was about the Jobs area of Proz, then perhaps my response would be different), so using Platinum membership as a criterion for Kudoz issues would be fundamentally unfair.
I was initially thinking of suggesting that the poll be restricted to those who have contributed to kudoz, possibly within a certain timeframe, but thinking about it further, it could be that people are NOT contributing to kudoz BECAUSE they are unhappy with how it works, so whay not give them a vote?
Obviously other combinations and options are possible: Platinum members plus contributors over the last x months, giving a weighting to the votes of platinum members and/or contributors, but really, we could just keep it simple - one member, one vote.
| | | | two2tango 
Argentina
Local time: 05:09
Član
engleski na španjolski
+ ...
| A member, a reason | Apr 19, 2005 |
Charlie Bavington wrote:
People pay to be platinum for the advantages it brings to the Jobs aspect, not the Kudoz aspect (so if the poll was about the Jobs area of Proz, then perhaps my response would be different), so using Platinum membership as a criterion for Kudoz issues would be fundamentally unfair.
I guess every member has his/her own reasons for being (or not being) Platinum.
Enrique
| | | | | Well, there you have it | Apr 20, 2005 |
http://www.proz.com/topic/31499
Platinum membership is now no longer simply a question of certain advantages in the Jobs arena, but is now spreading to kudoz as well...
| | | | two2tango
Argentina
Local time: 05:09
Član
engleski na španjolski
+ ...
| Why the surprise? | Apr 20, 2005 |
Charlie Bavington wrote:
http://www.proz.com/topic/31499
Platinum membership is now no longer simply a question of certain advantages in the Jobs arena, but is now spreading to kudoz as well...
Hi Charlie,
Why are you surprised by the fact that members who support the site with their memberships get more benefits than those who don't?
Cheers,
Enrique
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Gina W
Sjedinjene Američke Države
Local time: 04:09
Član (2003)
francuski na engleski
| I agree - why should someone be posting questions without being registered? | Apr 21, 2005 |
Non-registered users still have the choice to post questions. That is the problem. To resolve the problem, that choice needs to be taken away. They should be required to register (and preferably pay) in order to post questions.
I agree, except the part about 'preferably pay', I respectfully disagree on that point. But yes, I would never be posting questions had I not ever registered for the site. I'm surprized it's even an option.
| | | | | need more restrictions. | Apr 21, 2005 |
Non-registered users still have the choice to post questions. That is the problem. To resolve the problem, that choice needs to be taken away. They should be required to register (and preferably pay) in order to post questions.
I agree as well, has anybody seen both the Armenian>English and English>Armenian sections? First of all, most who post the questions are non-registered, and ask questions like "I love you" and "how are you?. I understand there is not many online dictionarys for these languages, but I still find it very inapropriate.
| | | | | How about redirecting non-members to NonProZ.com? | Apr 21, 2005 |
sarahl wrote:
how about redirecting the askers who need a translation for "Happy Birthday" or "Welcome to Paris" to Babelfish?
What plagues KudoZ is not different levels of difficulty of questions, but an unhappy mix of types of participation, professional and non-professional. These are two legitimate forms of participation, so long as each takes place in its own zone. Allowing them to participate in the same zone is like alowing tricycles on a superhighway.
A serious professional trying to use KudoZ on ProZ should be registered (preferably paid) and logged. An unlogged or unregistered user is to be considered a non-professional user. A non-professional trying to post a question should be automatically re-directed to a sister website (how about "NonProZ.com"?), where none of the restrictions that apply in ProZ.com would be applicable:
- No user needs to be registered, paid, or logged in;
- No limit on the number of daily or annual questions, no limit on the number of words in the head term, no limit on the number of terms in a question;
- No user needs to show any professionalism: No required level of difficulty or seriousness; no need to attempt to consult KudoZ glossaries, Babelfish, home dictionaries, or any online resource before posting a question; no harm if the asker answers his own questions;
- No strict methodology or structure: Nobody would be be nagged about the need to include sufficient context, to close answered or unanswered questions, to appropriately select the most helpful answer, or to award an appropriate number of points (no points need to be given anyway).
Users of this sister service would blissfully go about their business (or pleasure) unmolested. They would eventually learn to go directly to UnProZ.com to do whatever it is they do; ProZ would be as useless for their pursuits as UnProZ would be for a professional linguist.
Ten minutes ago, I have purchased the domain unproz.com. I will happily donate it to ProZ.com to to resolve this problem.
| | | | NancyLynn
Kanada
Local time: 04:09
francuski na engleski
+ ...
MODERATOR | nonproz.com LOL | Apr 21, 2005 |
I'm surprised it was still available !
You really are serious about this, Fuad, aren't you?
Today I squashed a Eng-Fr question: Hello. The additional context? I need the translation for Hello into as many languages as possible.
In order to head off point grabbers I rushed to squash it but was behind two other members who chose not to answer, but rather used the Ask the Asker box to tell the as... See more I'm surprised it was still available !
You really are serious about this, Fuad, aren't you?
Today I squashed a Eng-Fr question: Hello. The additional context? I need the translation for Hello into as many languages as possible.
In order to head off point grabbers I rushed to squash it but was behind two other members who chose not to answer, but rather used the Ask the Asker box to tell the asker that any dictionary would tell you that.
When you squash a question, you have to tick a reason. Here's the one I ticked: Unprofessional; lacks literary merit.
Perhaps more squashing like this, rather than point-grabbing, would help.
Nancy
[Edited at 2005-04-21 21:40] ▲ Collapse
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| Imagine KudoZ with a far lower squashing rate | Apr 21, 2005 |
NancyLynn wrote:
You really are serious about this, Fuad, aren't you?
Nancy
Serious as a heart attack.
Non-professionals are very nice people. They should not be squashed, but gently redirected. When a cute, little, green lizard mistakenly enters your office, you open a window and gently invite it out -- back to the garden where it came from.
[Edited at 2005-04-23 11:23]
| | | | Konstantin Kisin
Ujedinjeno Kraljevstvo
Local time: 09:09
ruski na engleski
+ ...
Squashing other people's questions, however justifiably, is a really unpleasant business in my experience.
I once squashed a question from a lady, who had clearly not used Kudoz before, asking for help finding a dictionary. I squashed the question and politely suggested that she use one of the many forums concerned with resources, Russian and so on.
I can't remember what exactly was said but for the next 5 hours I was bombarded with e-mails commenting very "positively" ... See more Squashing other people's questions, however justifiably, is a really unpleasant business in my experience.
I once squashed a question from a lady, who had clearly not used Kudoz before, asking for help finding a dictionary. I squashed the question and politely suggested that she use one of the many forums concerned with resources, Russian and so on.
I can't remember what exactly was said but for the next 5 hours I was bombarded with e-mails commenting very "positively" on me, my mother, other family members, my pets (which I have none of), my profile, my professionalism, my looks, my sunglasses (now this really got to me!) and many other aspects of my life she clearly had no idea about.
Of course I didn't take any of this personally - I was more concerned that I had upset someone with a genuine request for help by simply applying the rules. Since then I generally prefer to leave squashing to moderators and use the "Ask the asker" box to make my comments.
[Edited at 2005-04-21 22:19]
[Edited at 2005-04-21 22:20] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Gina W
Sjedinjene Američke Države
Local time: 04:09
Član (2003)
francuski na engleski
Konstantin Kisin wrote:
Squashing other people's questions, however justifiably, is a really unpleasant business in my experience.
Yes, I think squashing is a bit rude. Then again, so are some of the comments some people post in response to questions or answers ("anyone with a dictionary should know this", or "yes, it's just elementary French", for example). Actually I am surprized nobody has tried to squash mine, I know one person complained to a moderator about the number of questions I posted once, the moderator then checked out all my questions and said that I was fine, which is kind of interesting. Anyway...just my two cents on that. I would think that "Hello" is a valid question to squash in ANY language, but actual terminology and phrases are not.
Can someone tell me who is able to squash a question and is it automatic, and how does it work, exactly? Thanks.
| | | | gianfranco
Brazil
Local time: 05:09
Član (2001)
engleski na talijanski
+ ...
| Complete list of valid reasons for removing a KudoZ question | Apr 23, 2005 |
gad wrote:
...
Can someone tell me who is able to squash a question and is it automatic, and how does it work, exactly? Thanks.
KudoZ questions can be removed (squashed) by any site moderator and all members having reached 500 KudoZ popints.
The action is logged and a notification is sent to the language pair moderator and to the person posting the question.
See below the complete list of reason available for removing a question:
(-) Offensive (sexist, racist, etc.)
(-) Adult nature and/or profane
(-) Unprofessional; lacks literary/technical merit
(-) Nonsense
(-) Repetition (ie. exactly same as prev/next question) *
(-) Text to be translated is longer than ten words
(-) Includes more than one term question
(-) Not a language question
(-) Incomplete question
(-) Asker and answerer the same
(-) Asker requested removal of question *
(-) Staff testing
(-) Other: ...... a reason must be provided here .....
bye
Gianfranco
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lien
Nizozemska
Local time: 10:09
engleski na francuski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME
The squaching function has been taken out, I wonder why. Does somebody know the reason?
| | | | | The present system makes excessive squashing unavoidable | Apr 23, 2005 |
Konstantin Kisin wrote:
I was more concerned that I had upset someone with a genuine request for help by simply applying the rules. Since then I generally prefer to leave squashing to moderators and use the "Ask the asker" box to make my comments.
You are a gentle spirit.
Professional members of ProZ.com know very well that KudoZ is for consulting with other professionals about terms. But since the present system allows anybody and everybody to post questions (any number of questions) upon their first visit to the site, the chances of having inapporpriate questions posted, and hence the chances of squashing, are multiplied.
I have done more than my share of squashing. It is never pleasant, and rarely comfortable. As they say, it is a dirty job, but someone has got to do it.
The point I tried to raise in response to NacyLynn's posting is that the rushing to squash an inappropriate question in order to head off a point grabbing frenzy would be unnecessary if inapprporiate sources of inappropriate questions were simply redirected to a more suitable venue for their needs. This would not eliminate all squashing, but it would make ProZing a lot saner, let alone more pleasant and more comfortable.
That is why I suggested nonProZ.com as an alternative for those who "need" the word "hello" in every imaginable language and for those who are looking for a dictionary but would not stop to think where best to post their question. Something like nonProZ.com would be a nonprofessional playground for folks who do not feel the need to belong to a professional site with professional standards and professional annual dues. The squashing (and ticking a reason for squashing) would drop drastically, the same way collisions drop drastically when tricyles are barred from superhighways and redirected to playgrounds.
That is what I tried to say.
| | | | Mats Wiman
Švedska
Local time: 10:09
Član (2000)
njemački na švedski
+ ...
U sjećanje | My golden rule | Apr 23, 2005 |
Dear Gad and all seeing squashing as problematic,
There is a very simple rule which I apply and admonish others to apply:
If a question does not attain the level where you want to dwelve - skip it as fast as lightning
Result: Peace of mind and no insult to the innocent asker.
Mats
[Edited at 2005-04-23 12:40]
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