Björn Vrooman Dec 27, 2023:

There's no mention of any writing instruments; why would there be? Cf.:
"Ein Kugelschreiber ist dokumentenecht, wenn die Tinte in der Mine gewisse Anforderungen erfüllt. Diese Anforderungen sind in der ISO-Norm 12757-2 DOC genau definiert und festgelegt. Nur wenn die Tintenpaste alle Voraussetzungen erfüllt, erhält Sie die Auszeichnung mit der entsprechenden Norm."
https://www.kronauer.de/news/kugelschreiber_und_dokumentenec...

"Dokumentenechtheit ist eine Eigenschaft von Schreibmedien, z. B. Tinte, zur Herstellung von Schriftstücken und Urkunden (Dokumenten)...
Tinten, die für Füllfederhalter vorgesehen sind, erfüllen nicht immer die Bedingung der Dokumentenechtheit."
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dokumentenechtheit

The last sentence is especially important; it shows that what pen you're using isn't really the issue. As one Jacksonville company put it:
"Indelible ink is defined as ink that cannot be erased or washed away. All Pilot Permanent Markers, Creative Markers and Ball Point Pens are considered to have indelible ink among writing and marking instruments."
https://pilotpen.us/Faqs

Also, Gavin, this has *nothing* to do with SAP.

Best

Björn Vrooman Dec 27, 2023:

OK... ...since there hasn't been any feedback, a few examples.

The Human Medicines Regulations 2012:
"(3) Condition B is that the prescription—

(a)is written in ink or otherwise so as to be indelible; or"
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2012/1916/regulation/217...

"Labels must be clear, legible and indelible and be written in English. They may also contain other languages but the information in each language must be the same."
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5a7f832040f0b...

"Readable. Records that need to be photocopied or scanned must
be readable. All entries should be made using black indelible ink."
https://www.lancashire.gov.uk/media/916216/record-keeping-ma...

"that is to say, it shall—

"(a) be written so as to be indelible, be dated and be signed by the person issuing it with his usual signature"
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2001/3998/regulation/15?...

" an egg is marked in the prescribed manner if it is marked on the shell distinctly and legibly in indelible ink,"
https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1965/1000/part/III/made/...

[...]

Björn Vrooman Dec 23, 2023:

What I don't quite get... ...is why everyone seems to be focused on the German word "Geräte"? Besides Phil's helpful hint, I would've expected someone to already come up with an idea like "indelible ink" or so? I can post some links later, but that's what I've seen on, for example, gov.uk pages.

After all, what device you're using is pretty much irrelevant, is it not?

Happy Holidays!

philgoddard Dec 20, 2023:

I think this may also include printers, in which case 'writing instruments' won't work. After all, people don't use pens very much these days.
http://edle-kugelschreiber.de/dokumentenechtheit/