| Stranica u temi: [1 2 3 4 5 6 7] > | to Kudoz or not to Kudoz? that is the question Postavljač teme: Gad Kohenov
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Gad Kohenov 
Izrael
Local time: 09:53
engleski na hebrejski
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A translator from Chile already wrote an article in this site about it. He says having a lot of Kudoz points is a myth or a legend. It does not promote you in anything. On the contrary - you are selling your hard earned knowlege (25 years in my case) for free! Does Proz give you a free yearly membership for answering all these questions? no. Just points worth nothing!
Who profits? the amateurs and exploiters who are allowed to enter Proz and not only bring harm the reputation of the webist... See more A translator from Chile already wrote an article in this site about it. He says having a lot of Kudoz points is a myth or a legend. It does not promote you in anything. On the contrary - you are selling your hard earned knowlege (25 years in my case) for free! Does Proz give you a free yearly membership for answering all these questions? no. Just points worth nothing!
Who profits? the amateurs and exploiters who are allowed to enter Proz and not only bring harm the reputation of the webiste, but also get their jobs done by us and for free. We provied them with the tough terms and they just add the connecting words. Their job is done in a jiffy and they offer work for 0.05$us and laugh at us for doing their job for them time and again. People with a score of 200 questions asked VS 0 answered?? exploiters or amateurs who can barely write their name in English, let alone do by themselves a legal text.
By answering them we are cutting the branch we are sitting on. In a few years we will have to work for next to nothing and blame ourselves for our blindness. We are not "upgraded typists" We studied and work for long years to get our superior knowledge of languages.
There should be a line popping up when someone with a score of x to 0 asks a question.
"This asker asked 1000 and answered 0". These people present a work that looks exactly as if we did it and give it for a lower price. Happy customer. Comes again and again to that translator. What do we get? Kudoz points worth nothing!
I am not going to sell myelf short anymore. How about you. Those who answer all the time, in my case 10 times more answers than questions, should be rewarded by a free yearly memebership. And that for selling our knowledge for free.
Else we should answer only those who answer (10 such people in every language combinations). We could declare a "Kudoz strike" for a week. I want to see how that will affect things. Or we could answer each other privately only (sending the questions privately to those who are known to answer legalese or any other subject in a certain language combination.
Don't you get it? united we stand divided we fall (a free fall).
The Italian translators got some changes here regarding prices. Agencies don't post prices now, they write best prices and bypass the new limitations. I just ignore them. So should you.
The economic crash of 2008 has a second "leg" which everyone will feel very strong this year.
European community? Micky Mouse crap. It will disintegrate in the future and there will be return to Marks, Francs and Pesetas etc. The UDS? the national debt will create inflation that will remind you of what happened in Yugoslavia in the 80s. an inflation of 5 with many many zeores after it. Euro does down, dollar goes down and we keep getting the same number of cents per word but it it is worth less and less by the day! And on top of that we sell our knowledge for free to the competition??
We are not Organized. We are used and abused according to the Roman law of "dividere et imperare" (divide and rule). Translation is a profession like any other liberal profession.
We should make the change. No one will bring it about for us. If we all refuse to work for less than a certain price, agencies will have to go to amaterus, and if we don't answer their questions in Kudoz their work will be bad. That way clients will learn a lesson. Amaterus and machines are going to make their clients run away from them.
What do you think? are you going to keep sellng your accumulated knowledge for free? for 4 points?
A Happy New Years to all real translators wherever you are@@
Desertfox ▲ Collapse
| | | | | My solution up to now: | Jan 1, 2011 |
I do not answer questions of askers who posted e.g. more than 2,000 questions and only approx. 10 answers.
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"We should make the change. No one will bring it about for us. If we all refuse to work for less than a certain price, agencies will have to go to amaterus, and if we don't answer their questions in Kudoz their work will be bad. That way clients will learn a lesson. Amaterus and machines are going to make their clients run away from them."
This is going to be a new move for this new year: 2011. I strongly support this action.
Soonthon Lupkitaro
| | | | Gad Kohenov
Izrael
Local time: 09:53
engleski na hebrejski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME
Hello Gudrun,
That's is being too liberal. 2000. I asked about 600 in circa 5 years. 2000 will last the entire career of some exploiters.
We should use the German sayings:
1) Verbunden werden auch did Schwachen machtig (union is strength).
2) Eintracht brings macht.
Every one by himself/herself? we have no power and will not achieve much.
D.F.
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Gad Kohenov
Izrael
Local time: 09:53
engleski na hebrejski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME | Amateurs --->Achtung typo | Jan 1, 2011 |
Sorry for that typo. Soonthon, with local translator association which are not strong enough and satisfy themselves by having us pay them membership fees, nothing can be achieved. And there is always someone who will (unfortunately) answer a question by someone who only asks. Human stupidy is limitless I am afraid.
Happy New Year,
Gad Kohenov
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Gudrun Wolfrath wrote:
I do not answer questions of askers who posted e.g. more than 2,000 questions and only approx. 10 answers.
In my case I only answer questions of people who clearly show that they care about the community (approx. same number of answers and questions). Even then, when I see someone who does not care enough to thank colleagues or answer questions, I filter them out immediately.
I also filter any asker I find who has over 200 questions or so without a single answer. If they don't help, they don't deserve my help.
| | | | | Don't agree - Points do matter | Jan 1, 2011 |
desertfox wrote:
Does Proz give you a free yearly membership for answering all these questions? no. Just points worth nothing!
I don't quite agree. I get contacted frequently by interesting companies via Proz.com who see my name because I have some Kudoz points. So the help I have provided to others does come back to me in the form of customers.
And let's face it: good customers (I mean those who treat you with respect, accept a reasonable rate, and have frequent jobs) know who answered and who asked, and will only care about those who are able of answering questions. As for bad companies... are we really that interested in them?
| | | | | Tomas and desertfox, | Jan 1, 2011 |
This was just to give an example (I had a specific asker in mind).
You are right, the limits should be more restricted.
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Gad Kohenov
Izrael
Local time: 09:53
engleski na hebrejski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME | You work with "big" languages. Hebrew is a "small" one | Jan 1, 2011 |
Hello Tomas,
Companies are helpful. They let us do the translation without needing to do too many haggling etc.
Finding direct clients which makes the companies unnecessary is quite difficult. The clients prefer to pay 30 cents per word to a translation bureau in their part of the world - to take care of everything for them. Instead for working directly with us for half the price or less. Maybe you have direct clients too and not only middlemen.
D.F.
| | | | Samuel Murray
Nizozemska
Local time: 08:53
Član (2006)
engleski na afrikaans
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| YAKC (yet another KudoZ complaint) | Jan 1, 2011 |
desertfox wrote:
1. ...having a lot of Kudoz points is a myth or a legend. It does not promote you in anything.
2. On the contrary - you are selling your hard earned knowlege (25 years in my case) for free!
Allow me to cut to the chase:
1. A higher score in Kudoz points will place your profile higher in directory search results.
2. Helping out colleagues and members of the public with term queries, for free, is a normal part of being a translator -- it is up to you to decide how much help you're willing to give, and to whom.
What's nice about KudoZ in this regard is that (a) the process is formalised, so you waste less time answering questions, and (b) the questions go to the group, so you don't look unresponsive if you choose not to respond.
By answering them we are cutting the branch we are sitting on. In a few years we will have to work for next to nothing and blame ourselves for our blindness.
Translators (and other experts) have been giving free term help to the public for decades (centuries, even), and the branch you're sitting on still hasn't been cut through.
We are not "upgraded typists" We studied and work for long years to get our superior knowledge of languages.
That is irrelevant to your initial point.
There should be a line popping up when someone with a score of x to 0 asks a question.
"This asker asked 1000 and answered 0".
I would have no objection to such a line. If you think it is a good idea, post it in the Suggestions forum.
The Italian translators got some changes here regarding prices. Agencies don't post prices now, they write best prices and bypass the new limitations.
Yes... a good example of how a democratic process (or a brute force one) resulted in the crippling of a feature that used to be more useful than it currently is, and which solved nothing in the end. Do you want to see the same thing happen to KudoZ?
| | | | Gad Kohenov
Izrael
Local time: 09:53
engleski na hebrejski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME
I had a prospective client who refused to pay a very reasonable price for several immigration documents. I refused to do the job. What happened next? Two days later another translator started asking Kudoz questions from the same documents. The coincidence was clear!
She took the job from me and hoped I will also answer her questions and do the job for her.
Since that day that translator is my list of "To be avoided".
When that happens to you tell me how you feel.
There ar... See more I had a prospective client who refused to pay a very reasonable price for several immigration documents. I refused to do the job. What happened next? Two days later another translator started asking Kudoz questions from the same documents. The coincidence was clear!
She took the job from me and hoped I will also answer her questions and do the job for her.
Since that day that translator is my list of "To be avoided".
When that happens to you tell me how you feel.
There are people who contribute to the community and should receive our help. No doubt about it. People who just want to know how to say "hello" in Hebrew (one time askers) are OK. But those who consistently ask legales-related questions (medical too) and don't bother opening a dictionary or google a term don't deserve help. And rewarding those who help by putting them at the top of the list works for some but not for others. Otherwise I wouldn't have time to answer Kudoz questions - I would be busy translating my own work and not providing ammunition to the competition!
A Happy New Year!
D.F.
[Edited at 2011-01-01 10:27 GMT] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Laurent KRAULAND (X)
Francuska
Local time: 08:53
francuski na njemački
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| Merci, Laurent | Jan 1, 2011 |
and happy new year.
| | | | Gad Kohenov
Izrael
Local time: 09:53
engleski na hebrejski
+ ...
POKRETAČ TEME | Merci Laurent | Jan 1, 2011 |
Pas de probleme avec ma langue maternelle. Interessant a lire.
Bonne annee.
| | | | imatahan
Brazil
Local time: 04:53
engleski na portugalski
+ ...
| All that happens | Jan 1, 2011 |
Kudoz is used for anyone through Google. So, it's an useful system, not only for translators but for the whole community, in a free access.
I've been absent from it for the latest months for several personal and professional reasons.
But I've noticed sometimes what Desertfox describes. Someone takes the work, maybe for less prices, and you see hundreds of questions (many very basic grrrrrrrrrr) about the subject and sometimes about the text itself, when you have access ... See more Kudoz is used for anyone through Google. So, it's an useful system, not only for translators but for the whole community, in a free access.
I've been absent from it for the latest months for several personal and professional reasons.
But I've noticed sometimes what Desertfox describes. Someone takes the work, maybe for less prices, and you see hundreds of questions (many very basic grrrrrrrrrr) about the subject and sometimes about the text itself, when you have access to it in advance (some companies do). What I do is not give support to those people. If you do not work in the legal, games or medical area, for example, why the hell do you accept that job? Isn't it shady tricking?
So, anyone should pay attention tothose "parasites" and do not answer them.
And one correction: if you have browniz points you can use them, or donate them.
Happy New Year to you all. ▲ Collapse
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